Jump to content
Sign in to follow this  
brownbrowneye

sr20-did timing...runs like bog...help...

Recommended Posts

ok so we did timing on my sr20 180 today. found out it had been running about +25 deg....

TDC is the gold mark. so we set it at +15 BTDC which is stock. BTW i have cat back and pod thats it for now....no boost controller.

i have been running about 11psi on my car and i thought it was because of the catback in pod...i knew it was a bit high but i had heard of similar reports so i just left it. my car was pretty quick running that boost.

now we did timing this arvo, and its at +15deg (stock) what its meant to be at. and my car has droped to 7psi and it feels slow as sh*t.... there are hesitations (flat spots) and there is lag between gear changes and before boost which i never had before. and u cant even hear the turbo spool or suck air in anymore...

whats causeing this? my car feels slow and sh*t and unresponsive now. and would having my timing set so high increase the boost????

matt.

brownbrowneye38144.8771412037

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hey was that Pivot thing plugged into your ECU??

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

yep. and it still is. and it was before i did timing and car was running fine. i know it definetly was not the pivot thing as its been set on "normal" (ie- doing nothing) since i saw it.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

ok, not really too sure than, i haven't done timing on twin cams before.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

hmmm just a stab in the dark but did you remember that the first marker on SR20s is -5 degrees not 0?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

the first marker on a sr20det is -5 deg not 0? hmmm....i gotta check that then...i think we took the first marker as 0....

ok cheers that mite be it. also i should do timing when the car is at full operating temp yeah?

 

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

yeah it goes -5, 0, 5, 10, 15, 20

 

The idle speed should be standard ~800rpm, so it will have to be at operating temp for that.

If you're not 100% sure you've done it right it would be a good idea to get it checked at a workshop because wrong timing settings can kill things pretty fast.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

what damage can too low timing do? say if its set at 10 not  15.... im going to change it tommorow asap anyway....jsut wonderin.

is it best to set my timing to 15deg btdc????

brownbrowneye38144.9666087963

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

low timing i think can just cause it to run hot no huge prob in short run but fix it up

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

is there a big diff between 10 and 15?? in driving?

why else would my car be running like sh*t after reducing the timing back to stock? and also would running such advanced timing make my boost go up? why would it have been running 11psi then drop back to 7psi from just changing the timing>?>>

 

 

brownbrowneye38144.9654282407

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I would expect that you haven't actually set it back to stock.

it's probably very retarded at the moment, so your engine won't make any power - and won't spool the turbo up.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

dude, make sure you follow THIS procedure:

 

timing2.jpg

 

 

e- adjust the timing using the CPS as you know, here is the diagram, yesss it starts on -5 you should really check these things hehe :) its probably at 10 degrees at the moment, lovely :) nice and safe at least man hehe.

 

timing1.jpgtroe66638144.993125

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

"race" engine i assume means rev?

and i cant understand that picture of where the TPS is at all...ill look for it in moring. any description of where to tps is?

i still want to know tho...why would my car have been runnning so fast and 11psi at 25deg and now that ive set it back it runs like sh*t?

brownbrowneye38144.9989699074

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

yes race = rev

 

youre running 15 degrees less timing dude that is a HUGE difference, and the total output of the engine is probably far less, perhaps making exhaust less pressurised, thus less spool for the turbo...surprised +10degrees would add 4psi of boost though so check all yoru vacuum lines and that kind of thing. However - the bottom line is - just get the ignition timing right, like back to 15 degrees using the correct procedure then recheck the boost. Also just to isolate the difference, you could put the timing BACK to +25degrees (which im surprised it wasnt pinging its face off at) and see if the boost is raised again. IF so then you know its just difference in engine output; after all, 15 degrees difference in timing is massive. You probably have yours at 10 not 15 as you suspect so its a massive diff to 25. If the boost stays at 7 you know youve done something else in the process of playing around, check everything you might have touched lol. Failing that you might have been measuring boost incorrectly before, since approx 7 is stock boost, but not sure how you could have been doing it wrong but hey its possible. Also for the record +25 degrees (if thats what it was, and not in fact 20 since you thought -5 was 0), and 11psi im surprised it wasnt pinging. 20degrees and 11 you might just get away with on really (really) good fuel but i would go for it lol.

 

 

Anyway the Throttle Position Sensor, is just to the right of where the accelerator cable winds up in the engine bay and turns the throttle itself which opens the throttle body etc. The bit where the cable coils, just to the right around that area you'll see the TPS plug/clip, just unplug/unclip it as per the procedure.

 

If you dont do it, the timing adjustment will not be correct.

 

Travtroe66638145.0091435185

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

thanks for all ur help dude. im going to get up early and do it tommorw.

its wierd. i havnt touched anything else at all... and it just went to 7psi....i was always thinkin that its a bit wierd that my cars runnin 11psi with just a catback and pod and no other form of boost control.

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

that is weird...lol but hey 25 degrees thats a lot of timing im not sure how that would affect your boost.

nothing will be wrong i doubt, but 11 - 7psi is quite a loss and 25 degrees or 25 back to 10 is also quite a loss so it'll be feeling a bit on the sluggish side until you get timing back to stock and then if you have to, check everything and then raise boost manually with a ebc or valve to 11 or whatever again ;) 25 is a bit much timing thats all to be running safely.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

it's also possible that you checked the timing wrongly before, and it was set to 15, but you thought it was 25, so you've backed it off 10° and it's now running at 5°

 

When I first put my car together I ran 10° advance for ages for a bit of extra safety and it didn't make much difference compared to 15°

 

You really need to make sure it's being set accurately.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

nah when i first checked it it was set past the last marker..... im going to do it this arvo...see wots the problem

brownbrowneye38145.5418287037

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

keep us updated, im interested to know

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
nah when i first checked it it was set past the last marker..... im going to do it this arvo...see wots the problem

 

If you don't do it 100% right, with the revs at proper idle speed, and the tps disconnected the timing will be advanced by the ECU.

So your first check could have been completely wrong and it was actually running 15° already.

 

Why did you decide to check the timing in the first place?

It doesn't normally change itself. I've seen a few SRs that are dead on 15°, and still have the factory tape over the CAS adjustment bolt.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I suggest you do an ECU reset, cos perhaps cos you had it very advanced before, it retarded the timing in the mapping. SO thats why it runs bad now.

 

Reset, see how you go.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

in fact, there is no marker for 25 degrees so you were probably reading 15-20 hence wound it back to 5 most likely as dumhed has said ;) do your timing again! lol resetting the ECU would be a good idea too, perhaps before and after adjusting timing, checking it at all points. Then go for a hammering to check boost level and ECU state when you are sure timing is correct. ;) Do an ECU diagnostics if you start to clutch at straws.troe66638145.7875810185

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

ok so i checked timing again today following that proceedure that u showed me troe666. and it was bang on 15deg advance.

and OMG when i first checked my timing it was past all the notches....it was not even on a notch...it was 2 notches past the last notch (if u can get that)

 

i am taking my car to ICE this week. as i just installed a safc tonight. and ill get them to do a full diagnostic dyno tune up/ timing, and safc tune, plus probably whack a bleed valve in and set it to 9psi if every thing goes well.

i think thats what i need to do now. get it dyno tuned...will tell me exactly whats going on.

and im still stumped as to why i was running 11psi and now its gone to 7....hmmm

brownbrowneye38145.9766550926

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

normally the boost level will drop if you retard the timing a lot, because the engine is not making enough power to flow the gas to spool up the turbo.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

advancing 5 deg is quite a big difference. Every degree counts when comes to tunning on Dyno.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

i adjusted the timing on mine too far..when i came back after a run in the car to test it..we looked at the timing again..was at about 21 degrees......funny it was 15 or so we thought when i went off for a drive...

 

it was pinging under acceleration hey....set it back to about 16 degrees went for another drive and it was fine again...

 

I was glad to hear pinging cause now i know my car has never pinged before in its life cept for the time the timing was advanced....

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

Sign in to follow this  

×